Dwarvenite vs Resin

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Re: Dwarvenite vs Resin

Post by Oldent » Tue Jul 24, 2018 6:08 pm

The cost of PVC is penneys compared to resin, Resin is hard on molds. They stretch and wear out. They must be replaced at a steady rate.The labor is costly.Resin sets in hours and must be cured washed then sanded.It can be toxic. PVC injected molds cast many times faster and practically do not wear out.Injected molding is much more cost effective.
Time is money.
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Re: Dwarvenite vs Resin

Post by zenako » Tue Jul 24, 2018 5:43 pm

But then we have to deal with the nature of resin and how much easier it is to damage it. I know recent resin compounds are better, but they still have issues with fragility compared to the stupid tough Dwarvenite. I mean how rough were those campaigns Stephan was running that he needed to develop this compound to withstand the abuse!

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Re: Dwarvenite vs Resin

Post by marcoreds » Tue Jul 24, 2018 5:32 pm

zenako wrote:
Tue Jul 24, 2018 4:44 pm
If you are making literally millions of parts you need something that can be cast/formed at a serious production rate.
I agree, the pieces of which you need millions are better done in dwarvenite.

I don't know about the production speed of resin, or how it is cast in an "industrial" way (if it is possible to cast it in an industrial way).

Done "at home", the mold is quite cheap (and it gets ruined after a certain number of casts).
But consider that we're talking a cost of tens of $ instead of tens of thousands $, it's like three orders of magnitude cheaper.
If, let's say, with a mold you can cast 50 pieces, you need 40 of them to make 2000 pieces. You can make them all and pour them all together. And the mold cost would still be a minute fraction of a steel mold.


Maybe the time needed makes this impossible.
But cost-wise, given the numbers of each piece, I don't know…
If I check the cost of resin sets against the painted pieces of this KS, we're there.

I just think this is something that might be worth considering for DF.

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Re: Dwarvenite vs Resin

Post by Oldent » Tue Jul 24, 2018 5:25 pm

Resin is heavy and labor intensive to cast.I do not think there is anyone that can cast this kind of volume in a timely manner. I know that some of you already complain about shipping. As much as I love my resin, going back to resin is a very bad idea.
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Re: Dwarvenite vs Resin

Post by dice4hire » Tue Jul 24, 2018 5:01 pm

This is indeed an interesting question, and while I do not want DF to go back to resin for their main production, I also feel they are getting too crazy with their piece selection. I agree they are not printing large quantities of anything. I mean look how few even simple 2x2 floors there are in the encounters. In KSV a lot of pieces numbered in the double digits in a lot of encounters so they got economies of scale going. Here? I see no economies of scale, the numbers are just too low.
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Re: Dwarvenite vs Resin

Post by zenako » Tue Jul 24, 2018 4:44 pm

Resin is fine for low volume production but faces a lot of issues if you try to ramp up. Since the Resin has to cure and that can take many hours to a day, you have to create more molds if you need more volume and that has a cost as well. Pretty sure the injection molded? Dwarvenite has a minimal setting time and you can get hundreds if not thousands of parts in a day. (1 part per minute is 1440 parts a day).

If you are making literally millions of parts you need something that can be cast/formed at a serious production rate.

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Re: Dwarvenite vs Resin

Post by oddbender » Tue Jul 24, 2018 4:16 pm

Another factor I think you need to consider is the production capacity for resin pieces. My understanding from reading here on the forums is that there's a limit to how much and how fast resin sets can be produced. You just couldn't make the KS number of pieces in resin within a "reasonable" amount of time.

Again, I'm basing this on what I've read here, however, I feel certain that should be a consideration for a dwarvenite vs resin discussion.

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Re: Dwarvenite vs Resin

Post by Bossman » Tue Jul 24, 2018 4:10 pm

I was have some similar thoughts myself re the rising unit cost and lower production volumes per part. It will be interesting to see if any basic piece packs are released or built into the SG to increase the production units on core items.

It really makes sense to offer some simple pledges of core building items (without elevations) to build a new improved "basic" fan base onto which the bling can be added. Indeed a new collector and KS2 owner version of each of these could also be offered. This I think would be a powerful inducement to new collectors who are overwhelmed by the complexity and cost of this KS and accordingly not partaking.

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Re: Dwarvenite vs Resin

Post by AnimeSensei » Tue Jul 24, 2018 12:23 pm

Truthfully? I think we've surpassed the cost of resin and we did that in KS5 or with this KS. People assume now that resin is more expensive, but I really wonder if it's dwarvenite now.

I think you have and excellent point.
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Re: Dwarvenite vs Resin

Post by zenako » Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:59 am

Nice discussion. I do not have any of the vintage resin DF. I do have other resin items from various sources. I do have a fairly large amount of DF at this point.

I see DF having a challenge trying to both grow their fan base and continue to support existing customers who want something different to get. A new fan needs basic parts and likes the cool bling. The veteran has lots of basic parts and covets the cool bling.

What would be cool would be some more basic packs being made available in this KS that just cover the core range of items, walls, floors, curves and diagonals. Kind of like the packs back in KS2. Now I know they still are stocking KS2 packs (I have a few), and those were cheaper to make due to simpler molds I suspect. I know we have mentioned that to a few new folks on the forums to go and get some of the existing stuff right now, since this KS6 stuff will not be seen until late in 2019 I suspect.

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