KS3 - Wanting a 'Sewers Only' entry point

Law
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Re: KS3 - Wanting a 'Sewers Only' entry point

Post by Law » Mon Mar 23, 2015 10:29 pm

dandare wrote:I know you well enough to know this is a fun comment - but I do have a guilty feeling by not pledging. I have kept (mostly) silent on the forums as a consequence as I feel it 'wrong' to make my thoughts on 'grid gate' etc strongly known in the same way I did on my preference for 'windmill' KS2 junctions, exactly because I am not pledging...
I know the feeling -- I passed on KS2. I wanted DF to succeed, but I couldn't make it work on my end. I just couldn't justify getting Dwarvenite versions of sets I already own, for the most part -- and own many times over.

As it stands, I'm probably going to drop several hundred dollars on the stuff anyway because I'm jonesing for some DF now and this new stuff won't hit for another year. ;)

But I saved money for a nice long time by holding off. I like supporting DF, and I always will, but you gotta do what you gotta do. ;)

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Re: KS3 - Wanting a 'Sewers Only' entry point

Post by Duncan_and_Dragons » Mon Mar 23, 2015 5:12 pm

kitenerd wrote:Sure i save 10%, but with the shipping costs saved those savings are more like 25%
Oooh, I never thought about this. I was only thinking about saving 10%...now I need to buy more.

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Re: KS3 - Wanting a 'Sewers Only' entry point

Post by kitenerd » Mon Mar 23, 2015 5:06 pm

It is bad when you like the people you do business with so much that you feel like you cannot be critical. It is a really fine edge we walk here. Very easy to ruthlessly bash the faceless WotC, or even take cheap shots at Paizo... but here even a legitimate criticism feels like i am calling out one of my friends.

I love the enthusiasm of the creative team, and the silliness, and all the good fun, but some of the business decision leave you scratching your head. (Law had a great and well thought out post on this elsewhere - i won't rehash it). Sometimes it is refreshing to not be greeted by a glitzy soulless marketing machine, sometimes the bumbling can be charming. Other times not so much. In the end i am in for WAY more than i should be. Not because i NEED to have these toys, but because i like them and the people that make them and want to support cool people doing cool things.
"Miniatures?, sure sign of a petty mind!" - 'The Women' 1939

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Re: KS3 - Wanting a 'Sewers Only' entry point

Post by dandare » Mon Mar 23, 2015 1:34 pm

kitenerd wrote: The bad news is your money was supposed to get me more free stretch goasl. How dare you do this to me? I thought we were friends!
I know you well enough to know this is a fun comment - but I do have a guilty feeling by not pledging. I have kept (mostly) silent on the forums as a consequence as I feel it 'wrong' to make my thoughts on 'grid gate' etc strongly known in the same way I did on my preference for 'windmill' KS2 junctions, exactly because I am not pledging...

I can see that the KS3 has been successful to get all the main moulds paid for and that is great news in itself. You will all be very happy I am certain. And there are SO many moulds that DF keep releasing as add-on packs that judging by the $$$ gaps - that is not such an issue any more. Now all the extra money brings are nice stretch goals... Some of which would be nice to have in DF catalogue for all of us MBA customers at some point in the future... But not so much that I can throw 100s of $'s to see another ladder or maybe a fireplace or painted Rat pack etc etc.

Hopefully with my money in my wallet for another year means I now get to spend some on DF compatible items from ebay.. ;)

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Re: KS3 - Wanting a 'Sewers Only' entry point

Post by kitenerd » Mon Mar 23, 2015 1:25 pm

Sad to "lose" you Dandare, but i sympathize with your plight.

This KS is sprawling and i will end up spending far more on add on then i do on base sets - the main incentive is FREE SHIPPING (i'm in the US) - Sure i save 10%, but with the shipping costs saved those savings are more like 25% - WIth the less attractive (let's just leave it at that) shipping overseas those savings end up becoming a premium paid for a pre order which is hardly the point.

The good news is you will get your stuff almost as quickly as we all do and have your wallet full of money in the interim. The bad news is your money was supposed to get me more free stretch goasl. How dare you do this to me? I thought we were friends!
"Miniatures?, sure sign of a petty mind!" - 'The Women' 1939

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Re: KS3 - Wanting a 'Sewers Only' entry point

Post by dandare » Mon Mar 23, 2015 1:06 pm

HeroQuestFrance wrote:To Dandare :

Nice table you have there !
You may should take a look into the website of hotmatz.
They have nice colored maps with grid of 1 inch and of course several sizes.
Can you let me know where did you get the house on the pillars in the middle of your table ?
Thanks HeroQuestFrance, Those buildings have been pulled together over several years.
I fear that many of them are from a UK seller from ebay who used to make tons of pre-painted buildings in different combinations. Alas he stopped selling a couple of years ago and I have not seen them from anywhere else.

The only seller that is still selling buildings & 'interiors' that you see here and a brilliant 'town well' (Fenland Well) is Dr Willets Workshop. (Based in the UK - So no cross European taxes!)

http://drwillettsworkshop.blogspot.co.uk/search?q=house
&
http://drwillettsworkshop.blogspot.co.u ... -well.html

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Re: KS3 - Wanting a 'Sewers Only' entry point

Post by HeroQuestFrance » Mon Mar 23, 2015 12:15 pm

To Dandare :

Nice table you have there !
You may should take a look into the website of hotmatz.
They have nice colored maps with grid of 1 inch and of course several sizes.
Can you let mek now where did you get the house on the pilars in the middle of your table ?

About KS3, yeah, I'm agreed with you.
I even think the majority of the europeans will wait for Thod's offer next year.
It's the better solution to avoid high postage & package fees + a colossal VAT on the final price that definitively kills the desire to buy.
Those KS's are not really interesting for us unfortunately and we can't group orders too to get an advantage on the price. But anyway I wish the better to all backers and DF.

The sewer entry point is a good thing because some people do not care the town/village system and they are not forced to buy it. However, I share the point of view of many :
this is too much for this KS.
It would have been better to split it into parts (towns / sewers / castles).
After the thematic of the basic dungeons, then the caverns (ice / cold / normal), this one is offering too much at the same time limiting people to choose carefully and not to take everything in one time.

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Re: KS3 - Wanting a 'Sewers Only' entry point

Post by DungeonBuilder » Mon Mar 23, 2015 11:52 am

Reading through Stefan's comments this morning, I saw he posted some castle information over the weekend. Sounds like castles will be an even higher buy in, but I kind of expected that anyway. Here's his comment:
the castle we are prototyping is 8" x 8" base....really gigantic, especially if you put 4 of them together...and you will also be able to put 4" x 4" stone buildings on it of course, or tudor if you like that look:) The Town walls will be much bigger than these, but by default they will also be more expensive just by pure volume...these current battlements are more affordable and are also meant more for stone buildings in town, not for a castle, even though, if you really want to, you can build quite a large one, as Nate has done...but the castle we plan for next year will be the ultimate work of Art, that's one reason i postponed it for another year...to perfect it, and all it's glory...the gatehouse, drawbridge, portcullises, soaring towers, everything anyone will want who LOVES castles like I do....another reason to postpone was to give everyone a chance to "reload" because i predict a large castle with City battlements will be in the range of $400-$1500...or even up to $5000 if you want the works and lots and lots of curtain walls (just a guestimate)...I am sure I will not have quite as many backers, but it will be my masterpiece, like a ferrari or rolls royce of castles...for those who want the ultimate best...If it's out of range for most folks I apologise in advance, my passion has always been to make the best creations, regardless of what it costs to make, that is why my prices sometimes seem high to some, because the materials are top quality, we don't make the cheapest of things, and we hire the best sculptors, who are also not cheap...my margin for profit is very small...I recommend to build a small castle or keep using these buildings and crenelations offered now...you can build some really kool and exciting stuff with what we are offering now...I will certainly be building castles with it myself:)

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Re: KS3 - Wanting a 'Sewers Only' entry point

Post by dandare » Mon Mar 23, 2015 10:25 am

I am grateful that DF have added a 'Sewer only' pledge level.
I have now had time to look at it and work out the money and what I would actually be getting and not getting..

The Undercity Sewer set (painted) is $175 (Which is $10 more than the same Monster Sewer set - add-on and includes $20 shipping)
I then add +$75 for the 'top-up' International Shipping to the UK.
Thats a $250 entry level for Painted + International. With no extras. No Stretch Goals.

Then I would want another Monster Sewer Set as whilst one set looks great - 2 seems to make a full dungeon set up with enough to get the players lost!
Thats $165 ($205 with shipping)

I already own some MBS sets and the one other Stretch Goal that does interest me is the roof sets. But I am REALLY not sure why there are walls with doors in these sets ?!?
I want to buy 1 x Terracotta Roof and 1 x Slate Roof total (painted) $45 each set. ($65 with shipping) But I would end up with 4 x walls with doors that just seem a waste... (especially as I can imagine that pieces with moving parts are the most expensive.)

This all adds up to ($250 + $205 + $65 +$65) = $585
Shipping is $155 of this total.
Now before I press 'Pledge' I am thinking 'why'... There will not be any stretch goals to the 'Sewer Only' entry point so why not just wait until these reach the UK stores next year and buy what I can through Thod ?

I got what I asked for... but weighing up the money I may pass on this KS3 entirely. It has been a huge KS. For me to get enough of everything to be a useful amount on my table would have cost me circa $2k. Which ever way I do go - I wish this KS3 and everyone backing it and DF the best wishes. I am glad that the main goals have been reached and the main moulds are all but funded. Unlike KS1 where I actually pledged not because it was really getting something I wanted and already had in resin, but because I sensed that DF needed help and had to beat off competition. As a long standing DF fan owning dozens of resin sets, I wanted Stefan to continue leading this 3D field for us. its his passion and hobby, not just a business. Now we are at KS3, DF is breaking into new fields and doing it under its own steam. There are enough willing and happy backers to get the new sets made and out into the world and KS is now more of a mechanism than essential. Happy to keep using KS's but I implore you to make them smaller. Maybe do 2 a year and not have them so ranging ??

I hope KS4 will bring back the Tower Battlements as part of the rumoured 'Castle' build and that I can put to good use all of my KS1 pieces 'above ground'. I look forward to all the arches, crenelations, battlements + 'Moat' expansion packs, gaols, lean to wooden stables, great dinning hall fire places with braziers and tables and maybe a working draw bridge!

And... As this thread has also got some adventure chat (and that is why we are here after all!) I love a city / town / villages. Lots of adventures take place in them and the best role playing as the characters 'chat' in the bar, go get their armour fixed at the smithy and draw attention when they 'get it wrong' and walk around in their armour all day or 'over dressed' and attract the cut purse... I always DM the towns with gusto and build it as big as my table allows:

Image

This is the 'town' part of "The Keep on the Borderlands". You are all going to SOooo love having buildings!

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Re: KS3 - Wanting a 'Sewers Only' entry point

Post by dice4hire » Fri Mar 20, 2015 7:18 am

I hope sewers gets a lot of pledges. Likely a lot of international people will opt out though. Too pricey for International folks, unless they really care about 20 bucks. For 20 bucks I'll take the building.

But thanks tons for listening DF,
A pretty decent Docent of Valoria

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