Price in the webstore

Law
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Re: Price in the webstore

Post by Law » Wed Jun 13, 2018 8:17 am

I also admit I'm in crabby mode. In the span of about a week: everyone is getting their DoD but me, the full DoD is delayed, there are QC issues. It is just a bit much. And Tbf I'd probably be less harsh on QC and delays if I HAD MY FIRST SHIPMENT YET. ;)

Law
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Re: Price in the webstore

Post by Law » Wed Jun 13, 2018 7:54 am

I do understand the limitations of what we can expect, and the difficulty of getting anything to 100%. But that's why I revised my objection.

DF had the experience of multiple KS campaigns to determine which issues were essentially ineliminable. The warpage and distortions in some pieces - the Pacman problem - may not show up every time, but it's clear they show up often enough. Now both DoD and some upcoming cavern pieces depend on interlocking pieces. And that's where I get frustrated. When you know you can't get it to 100%, why design a mechanism that relies on it? The basic squares DF had been using since it started worked fine. Adding variety to what we can do was a great idea, but it's stunted by limitations in manufacturing. It chills my enthusiasm a bit. Seeing the gap between concept and execution bums me out. And I know everyone has different takes, some people don't mind the small gaps here and there. But - sigh.

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Re: Price in the webstore

Post by Rabbit Burner » Wed Jun 13, 2018 5:54 am

DevGuy wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 5:33 am
What/where are the issues being reported with the DoD? Thanks.
Most so far are in this thread we think :)

viewtopic.php?f=53&t=9167
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Re: Price in the webstore

Post by DevGuy » Wed Jun 13, 2018 5:33 am

What/where are the issues being reported with the DoD? Thanks.

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Re: Price in the webstore

Post by kodiakbear » Wed Jun 13, 2018 4:30 am

Quality Control when the factory is thousands of miles away is always going to be less that DF wants it to be, because they can not stop in and see it all often during the whole production time.

Let’s say DF makes a perfectly square corner and the factory makes a perfectly square mold and the piece comes out perfect and the worker even times down to the second the perfect amount of time to leave the piece in the water to cool down but due to all the hot air coming out of one person in this world the air in the factory is hotter making the pieces not perfectly cooled down and not perfectly square. Butterfly effect, chaos theory, globe warming or just too much B.S. from one person, either way it just got DF in hot water. If DF checks the quality and everything is fine, but a worker or boss pushes production faster after that by just two seconds that might be just enough to change a square corner into an issue. Same goes for painting and many of the other steps in production, and once the worker and or boss come to see the errored piece as ok QC is lessened.

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Re: Price in the webstore

Post by Rabbit Burner » Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:59 am

Law wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:18 am
Actually, I kinda take it back. What bugs me isn't the timing, or even the silence - it's the fact that they keep going bigger and more complex despite never having ironed out the issues with simpler and more straightforward.

Magnets in City Builder falling out? Castles will DEPEND on magnets!

Magnets in castles causing issues still? Magnetic accessories for DoD!

Some pieces warp or don't line up right in DoD? Caverns will involve multiple interlocking puzzle pieces!

Until warping, alignment and magnet issues are resolved to a much greater degree, it's gonna bug me that we seem to depend on them more and more. I know DF likes to dazzle with wow innovation - but let's walk before we run, guys!
Interesting ........ have to think about this ...........

The points you make are more than valid. Going to Play Devils Advocate here some (which we do a lot).

The Magnetic thing as much as I'd like to say they were fine, we had some fallout in both Cities and Castles, not a huge amount. Could see why people got worried from both a safety and building points of view. Though they rarely got in our way - but then we have superglue on standby as a matter of course (not just for DF).

But they have acknowledged it and reports so far have shown that magnets are not an issue with DoD.

So they are learning from previous mistakes.

Warp pieces, pacman and corner is something they should look to learn from, so as not to be an issue with pieces like this in the future. We have not seen much in the way of feedback as to why the pacman piece occurred or how they can avoid it in future. That's a little concerning.

The alignment issue we need to see for ourselves before we are prepared to comment on it.

The Walk before they can run, of course makes sense, but what would we lose if they did that. For instance what would we have lost in castles or in DoD if after the issues in the previous KS they took that understandable approach.

we are not sure what the correct answer is. We'd hate to have seen anything less in both Castles and DoD.

We feel that they perhaps they already do to a degree, in that largely most of what they do turn out to be as advertised or better.

So the reason we don't think we know what the answer is, is because they are already close enough to it, enough cool stuff to keep us excited, not enough issues to make us buy less.

This ratio is of course is different for different people, but it seems most are happy enough, even those showing the issues with DoD are saying they are still happy with it.

As for the lack of shipping notice ....happy thoughts Law ... hoping bunnies in the sunshine .....or machine gunned in an orgy of frustrated violence ..... your choice ;)

Remember that we will be waiting another 5 weeks after you get yours .........
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Law
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Re: Price in the webstore

Post by Law » Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:57 am

All good points. I do love DF and continue to support them - I'm going to back KS6 as much as my wallet and storage space will permit, and I'm still excited for my KS5 stuff (which, ahem, still hasn't shipped! Gah!)

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Re: Price in the webstore

Post by MrMorden » Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:52 am

As a slightly different perspective, I'm sure the DF folks are just as frustrated with QC/QA issues as some customers are. It's got to be annoying to provide sculpts, paint samples/instructions, and prototypes to a factory and have the finished product come back with issues. All while the backers are breathing down your neck to get the damned things shipped out AND be awesome.

Just remember there is no such thing as perfect, and everybody has a different idea of "good enough." Some of us would accept lower quality and faster shipments, others want near-perfection and are willing to wait. DF is trying to please both camps, so they have to find a dangerous middle ground where all of their customers are only a little disappointed.

Law
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Re: Price in the webstore

Post by Law » Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:24 am

To be fair, there have been improvements. But it does seem like we level up before anyone has seen a factory final product. DoD had multiple pieces that relied on interlocking elements - the circular walls in Lever Chamber which involve removable middle walls as well as an additional central square, or the swappable parts for the double door arch. And yet before anyone could verify whether warpage or alignment issues would kill those pieces, Caverns is shown to have been more. Sigh.

Law
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Re: Price in the webstore

Post by Law » Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:18 am

Actually, I kinda take it back. What bugs me isn't the timing, or even the silence - it's the fact that they keep going bigger and more complex despite never having ironed out the issues with simpler and more straightforward.

Magnets in City Builder falling out? Castles will DEPEND on magnets!

Magnets in castles causing issues still? Magnetic accessories for DoD!

Some pieces warp or don't line up right in DoD? Caverns will involve multiple interlocking puzzle pieces!

Until warping, alignment and magnet issues are resolved to a much greater degree, it's gonna bug me that we seem to depend on them more and more. I know DF likes to dazzle with wow innovation - but let's walk before we run, guys!

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